I barely had time to fully delve into Amy Winehouse‘s music before she tragically lost her life, but when it came to her personal life, there seemed to be 24-hour news cycle that the tabloids ate up. The new documentary on Winehouse by renowned director Asif Kapadia (Senna), simply titled Amy, explores the behind-the-scenes journey of the famous singer and gives one a glimpse into her tragic story. She was more than just a tabloid headline. She was a woman full of love, joy, and a singular passion for music that was contagious and engrossing. She had nuance and Kapadia, utilizing hours of footage from media, friends, and especially manager Nick Shymansky, gives us a well-rounded look at the singer’s all-too-short life.
It was a great pleasure to get to talk with Shymansky on the phone to discuss the film and how he got involved. Considering he discovered Amy at a very young age and grew up alongside her, he was uncomfortable with the idea of being part of a documentary on one of his closest friends that he parted ways with shortly before she died. We touch on how the director convinced him to participate and sign off on the footage from his own personal tapes, as well as the lessons he and Winehouse’s friends learned from the tragedy. Additionally, we talk about where his drive to record his early years came from, the ways he has tried to move forward, and why he ultimately walked away from their friendship. It’s a heartbreaking documentary and the conversation we had doesn’t sugar-coat any of it which is why I’m proud of it. Enjoy the full conversation below.
The Film Stage: The film relies heavily on hand-held footage from what I assume was you, Amy, and some other various friends. It was all low-key homemade stuff from when you were just hanging out as friends. You couldn’t have known back then that you would end up using it in a film like this, but did you think you would ever look back on some of that stuff?
Nick Shymansky: No way, no. I was very young and I was very excited about Amy. Remember this was before people had cameras on their phones. My father is actually a videographer. So I grew up with this culture in my family. Like, film everything. So I literally have my life on VHS.
So was a lot of the footage yours?
Yeah, yeah. Most of it is mine. I’m that guy that films every holiday and every event and then never watches it. Particularly in the era when it was all on tapes. I’d put the tape in the cupboard. But I was excited. We were on the road. We were doing things. I believed in her. And I wanted to show my friends. I wanted to feel proud.
So I filmed a lot of it and to be honest I never had any intention, even after she died, to go there. I certainly wasn’t in the right headspace to watch this stuff. I felt very negative about the fact that there was a film being made. I thought it was way too soon and didn’t know why people were doing this. Then through a whole chain of events I ended up changing my mind. I spent some time with Asif and I believed in him.
Was there anything in particular that kind of swayed you?
Well, for one, it was made very clear to me that this film was being made regardless of my involvement. But I had to think about it. I had to think about what was bothering me. The biggest thing was that no one of any quality had put any time into Amy’s story. It was all very cheap, tabloid-y stuff. She died and because it wasn’t a murder there was no intellect. Apart from her mother and father writing a book, which in the best of worlds when your mother and father write a book, you’re only going to get one letter of thought. So for me, I thought about Asif and the fact that he made Senna, this incredible film. Had I not known about Senna I probably would have never even met him. But Senna is such a great film that is so deeply told about the person and about the subject.
So I spent some time with him and I thought this guy was the real deal and knew that he had been funded to make this film which meant he could put the time and space into it. I thought that if ever I was going to do anything to set the record straight in terms of Amy’s beauty, brilliance, and story. I thought there was a lot of unfair perception of Amy as a person. To a lot of people she was seen as a total fuck-up. To me, there was a lot more. I never saw any questioning about the fact that she was suffering from depression or mental health. For all the pictures, for all the magazines, and all the avenues of coverage around the Back to Black years… I mean the album is called Back to Black. There was never any real thought or journalistic investigation into the fact that she was suffering from severe depression and got very lost in it all. Asif was great and very relaxed throughout the whole process. At no point was he being pushy. I think I could have just walked away and he would have probably allowed me to. And he also said to me, “What’s your biggest fear?” And I told him, “My biggest fear is that you make a glossy story that doesn’t feel like the truth.” And I said, “Even if you want to make the right film, someone is going to stop you somewhere.” So he said, “Okay, the only way I can prove that is by doing it. And the only way I can do it is if people back me to do it.”
So we came up with this understanding that I would eventually give him my tapes and give him the interviews, but I certainly wouldn’t sign a release form until I felt like I was seeing the finished product. Then it was a long process. We spent a lot of time together and eventually I said to him you can’t make a film about Amy unless you talk to Juliette [Ashby] and Lauren [Gilbert]. They’re like sisters, man. When I saw the first cut of the film I was so nervous. I didn’t care whether he was going to use 10 seconds of my footage or an hour of it, as long as he was getting the essence of Amy. I thought it was incredible because he had managed to really show the Amy that I remember. He brought some very sensitive issues in. I didn’t feel like he was being too judgmental. And he has also found a way of making a social commentary on it. It really brings a lot of interesting, modern issues into the spotlight.
One thing that I was struck by during the film was the fact that Amy had enablers around her but also people that truly cared for her and were attempting to get her help. One of the things that I thought about was just that the film makes people from the outside feel like they could have tried to help. They could have tried to be there. But none of this was really going to fix what was broken with her. I imagine that it brought up a lot of emotions to watch this film. I’m sure a lot of us have had those friends that aren’t quite getting it and sometimes you do have to walk away. That seems like what you did and yet you were still there for her.
Yeah, that’s the hardest thing for me. What I’ve learned, and I’ve had three relationships, including Amy, where they ended up needing rehabilitation and intervention. Of those three, the only one that never came out of it was Amy. The other two relationships in my life have gotten completely back on track. What I would say is that — and it’s a good point, what you’re getting at. I’ve recently become a father so I have a perspective on this — you can really care about a kid. A nephew, a niece or even a friend’s kid. Really, you can have all the opinions and even say something to the kid. But really, if the parents aren’t there instilling that, then it’s a very hard situation.
What I found myself with Amy was I tried so hard to intervene. So did Juliette. So did Lauren. We constantly tried. But we suddenly realized, out of nowhere, we were dealing with someone’s wife… she was married; we were dealing with someone’s daughter, she had parents there; she even had a new manager. And all of a sudden we’re dealing with this person that has this really bad support system around her. We’ve gone from being the most important people to not the most important people and on top of it the people around us seem to be really into this idea of making money and getting recognition and all the things that come with being extremely successful and famous. I constantly fantasize about whether I should have walked around with a baseball bat? But the reality is, man, when the core team around someone becomes a team that doesn’t have that person’s best interests at heart to get them focused and back on track, it’s near enough impossible.
Months before she died, she had a huge relapse. She ended up in a place called The Prairie. It’s a famous rehab location in London. But it’s kind of one of those places that’s a notch up from being a spa. It’s bullshit. It’s just a very expensive retreat. But it was all over the news that the doctor was saying that she’s in a very dangerous space and it was very well-publicized. So the whole country knew she was on her last legs. Two weeks later, she’s playing a gig in Belgrade. I spent some time recently, and I’m not going to say who it was, with a manager of one of the biggest artists in the world and he said to me, “Do you know how many times we get huge requests that I just say no to? I don’t even discuss it with the artist.”
Yeah, they know the head-space of their artists so why even bring it up?
Even if she wanted to do it — which I know she didn’t — a good manager, good parents, good people around you would have just gone, “Absolutely not. In fact, over my dead body. You have to get past me if you’re going to play this gig.”
I’ve never wanted to come across as self righteous. I’m not saying it would have been any different if I carried on as her manager. But Juliette, Lauren, and myself made a statement to Amy that was very clear. We’re going to sacrifice… think about Juliette and Lauren. They grew up with her. What’s better than your best mate becoming a star? Being rich and traveling around on jets and going to all these parties? It’s the dream. It could have been like Entourage or something for them. But they sacrificed that because they couldn’t watch their friend in that position. And unfortunately, not enough of that went on with Amy. If it did, maybe she would have focused and got back on track. We’ll never know.
Amy is now in theaters.